Loopy Planning Templates in Campaign Logger vNext

[JochenL]

Is it possible to get some 'loopy planning' templates? It seems like that is a big part of what Campaign Logger is based on so some templates to assist with it would be nice!

That's a good idea!

@JohnnFour, @Rardian, and all CL users let's brainstorm!

 

[pbianchi]

The first three found in my CL

In [LOCATION], [NPC] [TAKES ACTION] to [ACCOMPLISH GOAL] against [THE TARGET] because [MOTIVES].

|| || Gateway || Challenge ||Tension || Climax || Twist
|| Adventure issue || || || || ||
|| First Progress || || || || ||
|| Second Progress || || || || ||
|| First Minor Issue || || || || ||
|| Second Minor Issue || || || || ||

|| NPC Name || *"Template"
|| Appearence || Head / Body / Cloths
|| Nature, temperament ||
|| How he thinks privately ||
|| Trait, feature ||
|| Physical trait||
|| Secret ||
|| Relationship ||
|| What he is doing when encountered ||

I add that the NPC template is linked to an output of a Generator

 

[pbianchi]

Just to expand a bit the topic.
Would it be possible to define custom private (=not shared) templates for each CL user?
And then recall them as for the 5RD or 5RC?
Would it be useful to somebody?

 

[JohnnFour]

We have "templates" as a backlog item. We don't have requirements defined yet, but it's something we'd love to deploy in the future.

Today, you can create a Log and add your templates as Log Entries. Then you can Clone a Log Entry anytime into other Campaign Logs for instant template creation.

 

[pbianchi]

We have "templates" as a backlog item. We don't have requirements defined yet, but it's something we'd love to deploy in the future.

Today, you can create a Log and add your templates as Log Entries. Then you can Clone a Log Entry anytime into other Campaign Logs for instant template creation.

Thank you Johnn, it is exactly the way I use them. I was looking more towards things like the 5RD/5RC even though my current solution serves me well.

 

[JohnnFour]

Cool beans. We have big ideas for templates, but we need to ensure they fit and flow right with things, so we'll be a bit careful with this feature's planning.

What features would you like for Templates ala 5RD/5RC?

 

[pbianchi]

As mentioned the possibility to define my own templates. Maybe with something like the generators feature
So it is a two step process: first define a template, then use it in a log
I like the graphic scheme with multiple column of the existing 5RD/5RC templates
I like the fact to recall one of them easily by typing ```5rd
I like the fact to be able to redefine the title of template sections
I would love to have the CL tag feature working everywhere (I think it is already the case)
I would love to be able to insert an image in cells
I would love to have the possibility to share them in a library where all users can have a look and decide to use them/import them in their own "space"

Just my first thoughts about it

 

[shadowrahl]

This is an elaboration on the Loopy Planning Template I discussed earlier - but first I would just like to say, I really like a lot of the stuff that has been added to this tool, it has come very far. It has hit the point where I think it is now my favorite DM source of truth - or quickly becoming that.

I think templates organize many of the needs very well - the one drawback I've noticed is that bulleted lists and other things don't work within the templates (this goes for the mermaid graphing as well and limits where I can't use the main symbols either can we get it so links and the other wiki tools are usable within these resources or is it exclusionary?)

I also feel 5 room dungeons is a very specific template when the template itself is somewhat generic. I think generic terms like 3x3 template may work like ```3x3 then you could do 4x4, 5x5, 2x3, 1x6 etc. One template 'idea' but you can organize however you need to and ```5rdt could just be ```3x3 with prefilled information (this might make it a lot easier to spin up additional template options since we are just defaulting the information to those commonly used)

So for Loopy Planning - Personally I really want to get a solid grasp on loopy planning, as I mentioned and I feel it can be organized much cleaner, and consistently so that's where I think the template comes in - so things appropriate 'attach' to the Loopy Plan. I think the Plan should tie in to the 'Notes' as well as the Campaign Entries in a clean way - I plan on having a 'Campaign Entry' for each of my loops so I guess that's what I'm looking for a nice solid entry for.

For me the problem is I need more 'data' on the characters to see the hooks and I really want to delve into the story and the psychology so I keep a lot of detailed notes. I am very thorough and all the stars need to align and make sense to the character at their core. Because of this complexity - I favor always the things which let me drill down to whatever I need (when I may not know what I need) the quickest - I think we're getting there with this tool. Johnn would be the best person to probably decide what information should be present for a loopy plan, but I would imagine it would be something like:

Plan Source (Entity NPC, Event, Item, Organization, or whatever is initiating the loop)
Flavor/Flare (The Spirit of the Roleplay surrounding the loop - how they function, particularly important for NPC related where it should fit the NPC)
Next Steps (The next steps to reach the overriding agenda)
Agenda (The goal or overriding target the Plan Source is trying to reach)
Coinciding Loops (Other Loops relating to this one or fully encapsulating this one)

I added Coinciding Loops for this reason:

I feel there is also a hierarchy of loops - like perhaps you have a peasant who is struggling to deal with a grain shortage, then their daughter is kidnapped by goblins, the 'loop' is related to the peasant we'll call him George so the Plan Source is @George but perhaps larger loops encapsulate that and @George is kind of irrelevant in the grand scheme. Maybe @George has his loop relate to the larger loop of the grain shortage is caused by a lord selling out his country and the goblins are amassing because he needs a scapegoat - that may be a larger loop, and then the still larger loop is that he needs the resources because of a curse which will release a great monster from beneath town if it is not kept at bay so he views the issues as the lesser of two evils, and so on.

My problem is writing this out like I did above - easy. When I get my loops into Campaign Logger - it's hard to see the associations of the loops. It's hard to see the structure, I see the 'now' but not where I might be going and as shown - sometimes the 'source' of the loop changes as the Characters move their progression to deeper levels of the campaign.

I do care about the logs - but I find my value comes more from the campaign entries - and the logs exist to support that meat - I feel like the loopy planning template is what needs to somehow merge the logs and the entities cleanly making things clear and easy to generate and organize - this is after all about being the best organized you've ever been and helping with Brainstorming.

 

[shadowrahl]

I would also like a clean way to end a loop - right now I am adding an 'active' tag to loops which are not complete - but I think ideally I do want to have an easy way to kick a loop into an 'archive' (right now we have campaign entry and possible campaign entry but what I would like is to add a third state - active and not active)

So with NPC lets say @George dies - I mark his entity to 'Not Active' he's dead after-all. If he gets brought back through Deus Ex Machina then bam - I flip him back to active after asking how he came back.
If a Loop is Complete? Mark it to "Not Active' and allow searching to search for only Active data - I can still look up stuff on @George -but he's not cluttering my workspace at this time, same with old loops. It's like a Tag which is behind the scenes and present for every single entry with a default of Active.
I think this is important as things grow - since this is becoming my place of record - I don't want to delete my stuff here. I just don't want to see it when I am focusing on what is happening now (the original purpose of the tool).

I think this is important especially for Loops and 5 Room Dungeons as they are intended to have a lifespan that will typically NOT resolve the full campaign.

 

[JochenL]

usable within these resources or is it exclusionary?

No, we can get this to work!

I also feel 5 room dungeons is a very specific template when the template itself is somewhat generic. I think generic terms like 3x3 template may work like ```3x3 then you could do 4x4, 5x5, 2x3, 1x6 etc. One template 'idea' but you can organize however you need to and ```5rdt could just be ```3x3 with prefilled information (this might make it a lot easier to spin up additional template options since we are just defaulting the information to those commonly used)

I am planning to provide a button to add a pre-filled template so you just need to add your own stuff.

For a generic template, I was thinking of a way to describe it. Maybe something like Excel cell-addressing?

```template
[Title]
This will be full width if given...

[A1=Cell Title]
First cell in column A

[A2]
Second cell in column A

[B1]
First cell in column B

[B4]
Fourth cell in column B

[C2]
Second cell in column C
```

That would roughly look like this:

 

[zenironman]

View attachment 1658

This is very much what I would like to use, too. Thanks for being so responsive and brilliant!